- Therion - speleo.sk

Indicating passage height less than 1 foot
by Bill Gee 05 Nov '24

05 Nov '24

I asked this question a while back and got no answers. A new map I am working on really needs something that works, so I am asking again. The problem: When I use the Passage Height symbol with a value under 1, then it is drawn as 0 (zero). That is not right. The passage is NOT 0 feet high! It seems Therion rounds all values down to the nearest integer, so something like "=value [0.9 ft]" becomes 0. I can fit through a 0.8 foot passage - barely! How can the appropriate symbol be drawn? Do I need to think about creating my own symbol? I though about using a label. Two problems with that: First, it is not drawn inside a circle and so loses its meaning as a passage height indication. Second, sometimes I need to use a value like "<1". The "<" symbol has a special meaning inside label text. Thanks! -- =============== Bill Gee

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Unsupported date
by Andrew Atkinson 04 Nov '24

04 Nov '24

Hello After a few years of not using this data set http://www.cave-registry.org.uk/svn/CheddarCatchment/ I compiled this file http://www.cave-registry.org.uk/svn/CheddarCatchment/thconfig and it didn't work, giving this error therion 6.2.1 (2024-03-20) therion: warning -- Proj version mismatch: using 9.5.0, compiled against 9.4.1 cavern - Survex 1.4.12 initialization file: /etc/therion.ini reading ... done This is pdfTeX, Version 3.141592653-2.6-1.40.26 (TeX Live 2025/dev/Debian) (preloaded format=pdftex) restricted \write18 enabled. entering extended mode (./fonttest.tex checking optional fonts csr10 csti10 csbx10 csss10 csssi10 ... NOT INSTALLED This is pdfTeX, Version 3.141592653-2.6-1.40.26 (TeX Live 2025/dev/Debian) (preloaded format=pdftex) restricted \write18 enabled. entering extended mode (./fonttest.tex checking optional fonts cmcyr10 cmcti10 cmcbx10 cmcss10 cmcssi10 ... NOT INSTALLED configuration file: thconfig reading ... done reading source files ... done preprocessing database ... done therion: error -- automatic declination calculation before 1900 not supported, please specify declination explicitly I have no idea how a date before 1900 got in there, but a clue on where it is would be useful! Is there anything I can do to find out? Not sure about the Proj version mismatch, I'm on Debian trixie. It does not seem to be causing problems thanks Andrew

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Shape files import comes up in the wrong location in QGIS
by Andrew Atkinson 04 Nov '24

04 Nov '24

Hello With Xavier promising great things with style sheets for shp files ;-) I thought I should take a look at using shp files. I'm making progress with QGIS, it is a little confusing, so there are so many things I could have done wrong, plus I still really do not know what to search for when something does go wrong. On QGIS I've successfully imported therions kml file and the 3d produced using https://github.com/patrickbwarren/qgis3-survex-import Both of these appear about where I would expect them. When I import the .shp as a directory I'm given 4 options I don't really understand. However it appears in the sea, off the coast of Africa, I can change the projection CRS, but then it is still off the coast, but this time near the Silly Isles, so close to 0,0 for the OSGB grid. Which suggests to me that the file contains local co-ordinates of the map square ST which is how I inputted them. So why do the kml and the 3d import work in the right place and the shp not work? What am I missing? I'm sure this must have come up before in the mailing list, however, I cannot find it! I'm using http://www.cave-registry.org.uk/svn/CheddarCatchment/Goughs/ the thconfig_plan file Has been edited locally to have the following exports export map -proj plan -layout local -o Goughs_Plan.pdf export map -proj plan -layout local -o Goughs_Plan.kml export map -proj plan -layout local -o Goughs_Plan.bbox export map -proj plan -layout local -o Goughs_Plan.shp export model -o Goughsth.3d Andrew

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MetaPost random numbers question
by Bill Gee 24 Oct '24

24 Oct '24

Hello everyone - I have created a custom symbol for a broken stalagmite/stalactite. It is exactly the same as regular stalactite/stalagmite (also custom code) except turned on its side. I could use the orientation feature to simply turn the stalagmite symbol, but then it is not called out in the legend. I would like to have the code randomly point the symbol either left or right. My code uses the "uniformdeviate()" function to generate random numbers which are then tested. The problem is that the symbols point left far more often than right. I suspect the way I am using uniformdeviate is not right. I would appreciate someone getting an eyeball on my code to see if it at least sane. Code is below ... I have tried both "uniformdeviate(1)" and "uniformdeviate 1", with basically the same result. Both syntaxes compile without error. The very few samples I found while searching use both syntaxes. I found precious little in any of the MetaPost documentation about this function. Thanks! -- =============== Bill Gee # This code defines the broken stal symbol. def p_u_brokenstal (expr pos,theta,sc,al) = U:=(0.2u, 0.4u); T:=identity aligned al rotated theta scaled sc shifted pos; pickup PenC; #Draw and paint the symbol. Point randomly left or right if uniformdeviate(1) < 0.5: thfill (0.4u,0.2u)--(-0.4u,0.0u)--(0.4u,-0.2u)--cycle; else: thfill (-0.4u,0.2u)--(0.4u,0.0u)--(-0.4u,-0.2u)--cycle; fi enddef;

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Scaling all cross sections at once
by Tarquin Wilton-Jones 24 Oct '24

24 Oct '24

Hi, Feeling like I must have missed something, but I can't see it in the book, nor on any email threads. Can you do something like this for point section: -scale 2 Or some layout option to make cross sections display at twice their natural scale? Obviously the scrap scale can be set to twice what it really is, but this means that the data itself needs to be falsified, instead of just the layout. (I await being told of something blindingly obvious that I have forgotten.) Cheers, Tarquin

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Printing a sample of all symbols
by Bill Gee 22 Oct '24

22 Oct '24

There is a PDF on the Wiki page which shows all of the symbols in Therion version 5.3 It is hopelessly out of date. Version 6.2 has many more symbols that are not in the sample document, such as stalctite-with-disk, wheelchair, electric-light and more. Can someone please update the PDF on the Wiki? Is there a way to make Therion print a sample of all built-in symbols? Thanks! -- =============== Bill Gee

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AI and Therion
by Bruce Mutton 22 Oct '24

22 Oct '24

Just curious, if anyone is using AI to streamline Therion usage or solve Therion problems? Perhaps in conjunction with versioning platform such as github? For those of us who are not quite coders. I've not thought about it until right now, but a few possibilities come to mind: * Troubleshooting peculiar issues that affect only one equate of many in a project. Find possible reasons why a particular equate should crash Therion. * Trawling through a project and highlighting where that project is not internally consistent, and proposing changes. * Flattening a project that was created highly nested. * Drawing initial scrap outlines given a th2 file with xvi centrelines and PocketTopo or SexyTopo sketches as backgrounds. * Weeding out blank pages created with a particular export atlas, by adding a layout statement. * Optimising the layout origin position of export atlas to obtain an optimum atlas tessellation. * Create new metapost symbols. * Suggesting Therion source code changes to further develop atlas support for elevations. * Suggesting Therion source code changes to fix, or at least allow control of, line map-connection (problem description in https://github.com/therion/therion/issues/412 ) I have 21 Therion data repositories, some with many caves, that could be used to train an AI in my particular usage of Therion. There are others out there on the web that could be used to teach it a range of possible variations. Bruce Mutton

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Output coordinate system text has been corrupted
by Bruce Mutton 07 Oct '24

07 Oct '24

Hello In my thconfig file I typically specify an output coordinate system for exported maps. Typically I use: cs EPSG:2193 and this returns, by way of \outcsname in the header, "NZGD2000 / New Zealand Transverse Mercator 2000" Sometimes I use: cs EPSG:27200 and this used to return "NZGD49 / New Zealand Map Grid" Strangely today it returns "NZGD49 / New Zealand Map Griderse Mercator 2000", a strange combination of the correct text with part of the other coordinate system appended. Cannot find anywhere in my project where this text has been set (or indeed any manual setting of \outcsname), and could not find in github therion/therion either. It may be three years since I used cs EPSG:27200, and whenever that was, there were no problems. Where does Therion get the strings for EPSG coordinate systems from? This looks like it is probably an error at the users end, but could it be a problem with Therion or wherever Therion is getting the string from? Ideas? Bruce

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Request: SHP export improvements
by Xavier Robert 28 Sep '24

28 Sep '24

Dear all, I am mostly writing to Therion developers, as I am not able to propose a valid code modification myself. For a large project (Gouffre Jean-Bernard + Gouffre Mirolda, France), we are exporting the surveys as ESRI shapefiles to build a GIS. For that, we also are developing a style sheet to reproduce the Therion symbology inside QGIS. It permits us to have the complete survey database on our phones/tablets in the field as a GIS project (we are currently using Mergin Maps app with a custom server). For those interested in, please, see pages 89 - 95 of the report https://groupe-speleo-vulcain.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/03/2023_Rapport_E… <https://groupe-speleo-vulcain.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/03/2023_Rapport_E…> (in French). But, there are some points that quite problematics/time consuming, and that may (?) be improved directly in Therion with the ESRI/shp export command: for the shapefile points2d.shp, the Therion feature corresponding to the « -value » option is not exported. For us, this is a problem to render the point « height », as the value of the height does not exists in the shp —> If in a next Therion release the -value option could be added to the attribut table of the point2d.shp, it would be great! in our GIS, we want to get the altitude information for at least station points. This information is not included in the attribut tables (points2d.shp and stations3d.shp). To get it, we have to reprocess the station3d.shp with a python script to add the altitude value in the attribut table after each new Therion compilation —> Is it possible to add the station altitude value in the attribut table directly from Therion shp export? The lines and areas shapefiles produced by Therion export are not limited to the inside of the cave (i.e. inside of the outline), even if they have the -clip on option. We need to use a custom Python script to cut the lines and areas with the outline shapefile as a mask, and this is absolutely not tolerant even for a very minor topologic error. —> Is it possible to modify the ESRI/shp exportation function from Therion to natively masked the lines and areas that have the -clip on option and that are outside of the cave outline ? Is that possible to implement these features in a future Therion release? Thanks a lot, Cheers, Xavier

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Text color
by Yann Gardère 24 Sep '24

24 Sep '24

Hi Does anyone have a solution to set the text color? (Point label) Maybe by code metapost ? Thanks Yann

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