October 2008 - Therion

standard deviation and survey grade
by Bruce Mutton 17 Dec '08

17 Dec '08

Time has come to assign my least accurate survey data a lower accuracy! I'm curious as to how Therion deals with the std deviations. Had a look, but can not find much more than is in the Therion book. First, what are the default values adopted by Therion? Currently I have only one survey in a large(ish) dataset that has been allocated sd's. From a casual look at the distortions it clearly works - in that a nice result is obtained with more distortion in the lower accuracy area. I guess that if the default values are zero, then all the distortion would be forced to an area given non-zero sd's; Is this how it works? In this case it would seem that if one survey parameter has a sd setting, all the surveys should all have their respective settings allocated for this parameter to more accurately model a realistic distribution of corrections. Second, has anyone made any attempt to associate sd values with recognised cave survey grades (bcra grades for example). Here is my off the cuff assessment of what in NZ some people call bcra5 but is really well short. grade NZBCRA4 # Bruces assessment of the BEST typical NZ surveying practice MIGHT achieve tape length 0.1 meter # ie -0.2m to +0.2m for measurement to chest to 0.1m compass bearing 1 deg # ie -2 deg to +2 deg for sighting to light of person on station to 1 deg gradient clino 1 deg # ie -2 deg to +2 deg for sighting to light of person on station and sometimes accounting for 'eye to light' offset to 1 deg endgrade I suspect the sd's may often be larger than this. The actual sd for polar measurements probably depends a lot on the average length of the legs I expect Thanks Bruce

6 13

Loch Units
by Jonny Prouty 25 Nov '08

25 Nov '08

I have a quick and hopefully simple question. How do I make therion output a loch model with imperial units as opposed to metric? The units in the survey are set to feet, but therion is interpreting them as meters. Any ideas? Thanks in advance! -Jonny ^v^

8 21

export cave-list
by Bruce Mutton 04 Nov '08

04 Nov '08

Just noticed a curious thing; a bug perhaps? The following lines give me an output that includes altitudes of entrances and no co-ordinates, as I would expect; #!CAVE LIST EXPORT export cave-list -output ./Outputs/GLMESM_SystemCaves.html #\ # -location on And the following gives entrance co-ordinates but no altitudes; #!CAVE LIST EXPORT export cave-list -output ./Outputs/GLMESM_SystemCaves.html \ -location on Why no altitudes?

3 10

Loch Segfault
by Martin Luethi 31 Oct '08

31 Oct '08

Hi Since a while I experience segfaults during startup of loch. The error is somewhat hard to pin down. It seems like loch (or some library it uses) tries to write onto a socket that is used for X11: === line 1177/8 === connect(5, {sa_family=AF_FILE, path="/tmp/.X11-unix/X0"...}, 110) = 0 getpeername(5, {sa_family=AF_FILE, path="/tmp/.X11-unix/X0"...}, [20]) = 0 ==== This happens with a fresh compile from 5.2.1 sources on a Ubuntu and on a Archlinux system. Thanks, Martin BTW: why is /etc/passwd read (line 1161)?

2 5

map-comment replace, concatinate, order
by Bruce Mutton 21 Oct '08

21 Oct '08

Just a comment on the behaviour of 'map-comment', and perhaps a request to make it more consistent. I have, for example, three layout files, one of them contains the following instructions, and it calls the two layouts, each of which is in it's own file and contains only a map-comment in it. map-comment "Preliminary Release October 2008...\ # line 1 <br><br>EXPLORATION NOTES:" copy LayoutGreenlinkAnnotation # line 2 copy LayoutSwissM_Annotation # line 3 Now as I requested some time back, the output pdf contains a concatenation of the three map comments. If I change the order of the last two lines, the output order changes. So far, so good. If I place line 1 at the end (or anywhere else), it's contents remain at the start of the concatenation. If I have multiple map-comment lines in any one layout, only the last map-comment is retained. (The original behaviour I believe) So two issues; 1. The order of the components is only partially controllable. 2. The concatenation (as opposed to replacement) modification has only partly being implemented. Is it possible to remedy these without messing up the processing a whole lot of (other peoples) maps? Taa, Bruce

1 0

Re: [Therion] scale image
by andrea.marassich＠email.it 15 Oct '08

15 Oct '08

Thanks a lot..... Andrea --------- Original Message -------- Da: "List for Therion users" <therion@speleo.sk> To: "'List for Therion users'" <therion@speleo.sk> Oggetto: Re: [Therion] scale image Data: 15/10/08 13:23 Hi Andrea I’ve got an output of sorts.  (You can rename the thc file to txt)   Errors that stopped your files compiling mainly to do with misnaming. File extensions missing in your thconfig file, selection of the map to plot missing.     Small glitches: Two bottom lines in isler.th2 needed reversing (tick the reverse box) so the yellow arrow points inside the passage.   Hope this gets you started again. Bruce     From: therion-bounces(a)speleo.sk [mailto:therion-bounces@speleo.sk] On Behalf Of andrea.marassich(a)email.it Sent: Wednesday, 15 October 2008 9:08 p.m. To: List for Therion users Subject: Re: [Therion] scale image   Hi,  sorry to bother you again with this issue, which probably is little bit beyond basics and beyond my current understanding of Therion, but it' the cave I'm working on, so I'm just in need of the output :) I just attach the files, hope it works. Maybe there's some very basic misunderstanding....not just the connection of the scraps. thanks a bunch Andrea   --------- Original Message -------- Da: "List for Therion users" <therion@speleo.sk> To: "List for Therion users" <therion@speleo.sk> Oggetto: Re: [Therion] scale image Data: 14/10/08 17:31 Hi Andrea, first sorry for the late answer, I am a little bit busy right now. Just to be sure, that I understand your problem correctly: You have an old drawing of some cave part without any centreline data, but you are able to map two stations in that drawing to stations in your centreline. Is this correct? If this is the situation, all you need to do is to add these two stations to this scrap and reference them with "-name" option to the names you know as you do for scraps where you have complete centreline. And new scrap should be placed correctly - I believe. More complicated it would be, if you will have just one or no station, but even this is feasible. If it does not help you, do not hesitate to send me some sample data that demonstrate your problem. My be I did not understood your problem correctly. Regards, S. On Fri, Oct 10, 2008 at 3:59 PM, <andrea.marassich@email.it> wrote: > Sorry, forgot to mention two stations of my centerline are located into the > image I can draw and which is without scale. > > hope this give you enough information. > > best, > > Andrea Marassich > > Hi, > > sorry to bother with a beginner question, but cannot make it even reading > through the archives. > > I have a .th file with centerline and .th2 file with his scraps. > > Now I should add to this a th2 file with an image of an old survey. I drawed > walls and all objects in the scrap but do not know the scale and do not have > original data of the centerline. > > How can I put together my centerline/scrap of known scale with this image? > Do not know how to do it and I'm having dificulty understanding how the > scale process is working. > > could you help me on this? > > thanks a lot > > Andrea Marassich > > _______________________________________________ > Therion mailing list > Therion(a)speleo.sk > http://mailman.speleo.sk/mailman/listinfo/therion > > _______________________________________________ Therion mailing list Therion(a)speleo.sk http://mailman.speleo.sk/mailman/listinfo/therion _______________________________________________ Therion mailing list Therion(a)speleo.sk http://mailman.speleo.sk/mailman/listinfo/therion

2 1

Re: [Therion] scale image
by andrea.marassich＠email.it 15 Oct '08

15 Oct '08

Hi,  sorry to bother you again with this issue, which probably is little bit beyond basics and beyond my current understanding of Therion, but it' the cave I'm working on, so I'm just in need of the output :) I just attach the files, hope it works. Maybe there's some very basic misunderstanding....not just the connection of the scraps. thanks a bunch Andrea   --------- Original Message -------- Da: "List for Therion users" <therion@speleo.sk> To: "List for Therion users" <therion@speleo.sk> Oggetto: Re: [Therion] scale image Data: 14/10/08 17:31 Hi Andrea, first sorry for the late answer, I am a little bit busy right now. Just to be sure, that I understand your problem correctly: You have an old drawing of some cave part without any centreline data, but you are able to map two stations in that drawing to stations in your centreline. Is this correct? If this is the situation, all you need to do is to add these two stations to this scrap and reference them with "-name" option to the names you know as you do for scraps where you have complete centreline. And new scrap should be placed correctly - I believe. More complicated it would be, if you will have just one or no station, but even this is feasible. If it does not help you, do not hesitate to send me some sample data that demonstrate your problem. My be I did not understood your problem correctly. Regards, S. On Fri, Oct 10, 2008 at 3:59 PM, <andrea.marassich@email.it> wrote: > Sorry, forgot to mention two stations of my centerline are located into the > image I can draw and which is without scale. > > hope this give you enough information. > > best, > > Andrea Marassich > > Hi, > > sorry to bother with a beginner question, but cannot make it even reading > through the archives. > > I have a .th file with centerline and .th2 file with his scraps. > > Now I should add to this a th2 file with an image of an old survey. I drawed > walls and all objects in the scrap but do not know the scale and do not have > original data of the centerline. > > How can I put together my centerline/scrap of known scale with this image? > Do not know how to do it and I'm having dificulty understanding how the > scale process is working. > > could you help me on this? > > thanks a lot > > Andrea Marassich > > _______________________________________________ > Therion mailing list > Therion(a)speleo.sk > http://mailman.speleo.sk/mailman/listinfo/therion > > _______________________________________________ Therion mailing list Therion(a)speleo.sk http://mailman.speleo.sk/mailman/listinfo/therion

2 1

symbol-show-and-hide
by Bruce Mutton 14 Oct '08

14 Oct '08

Hi again Been working on presentation some more, and have two more conundrums. How do I use a layout to hide altitude points attached to the cave walls? How do I show 'fixed' station points and show their names, but hide all other station points and names? debug station-names is too much. Bruce A sample of some of the show/hides I am using. #CAVE APPEARANCE #--------------- symbol-hide point cave-station symbol-show group cave-centreline #shows passage not yet drawn symbol-hide group surface-centreline #hide labels symbol-hide point label symbol-hide line label symbol-hide line arrow symbol-hide point altitude #symbol-hide line altitude #causes error symbol-hide point station-name #specific station name points - this line works fine with show or hide #hide sections symbol-hide point section #cross section locations symbol-hide line section #cross section cutting planes #blackout passage colour map-fg [0 0 0] #black # Shading in cave passage, <colour>, <altitude>, <scrap>, <map> # color map-fg map #colour map-fg [97 86 38] # yellow brown transparency off # see thru passages #opacity 40 # degree of transparency

2 2

More show and hide
by Bruce Mutton 14 Oct '08

14 Oct '08

Further to my last post. Have just figured out that the following statement will hide morphed sketches of caves. symbol-hide group surface-centreline # hides morphed sketches as well?? Is this by design, or is it a side effect of something else I may be doing? I'm using version 5.2 Perhaps it is because it is drawn on the same layer as the surface image? Bruce

2 2

Re: [Therion] scale image
by andrea.marassich＠email.it 14 Oct '08

14 Oct '08

Sorry, forgot to mention two stations of my centerline are located into the  image I can draw and which is without scale. hope this give you enough information. best, Andrea Marassich Hi, sorry to bother with a beginner question, but cannot make it even reading through the archives. I have a .th file with centerline and .th2 file with his scraps. Now I should add to this a th2 file with an image of an old survey. I drawed walls and all objects in the scrap but do not know the scale and do not have original data of the centerline. How can I put together my centerline/scrap of known scale with this image? Do not know how to do it and I'm having dificulty understanding how the scale process is working. could you help me on this? thanks a lot Andrea Marassich

3 2