I have a quick and hopefully simple question. How do I make therion output a loch model with imperial units as opposed to metric? The units in the survey are set to feet, but therion is interpreting them as meters. Any ideas? Thanks in advance! -Jonny ^v^
Ah ha! I figured it out. There is a 'units station feet' directive. I tried it out of the blue and it adjusted everything accordingly. I don't believe it is mentioned in the Therion Book, so perhaps it needs to be added. -Jonny On Tue, Oct 14, 2008 at 9:33 PM, Jonny Prouty <dormat@gmail.com> wrote:
I have a quick and hopefully simple question. How do I make therion output a loch model with imperial units as opposed to metric? The units in the survey are set to feet, but therion is interpreting them as meters. Any ideas? Thanks in advance!
-Jonny ^v^
Actually, no, I don't think I figured it out. I think I'm tired and I've tricked myself into thinking that that worked. I don't believe it did after all. Any ideas? On Tue, Oct 14, 2008 at 10:49 PM, Jonny Prouty <dormat@gmail.com> wrote:
Ah ha! I figured it out. There is a 'units station feet' directive. I tried it out of the blue and it adjusted everything accordingly. I don't believe it is mentioned in the Therion Book, so perhaps it needs to be added.
-Jonny
On Tue, Oct 14, 2008 at 9:33 PM, Jonny Prouty <dormat@gmail.com> wrote:
I have a quick and hopefully simple question. How do I make therion output a loch model with imperial units as opposed to metric? The units in the survey are set to feet, but therion is interpreting them as meters. Any ideas? Thanks in advance!
-Jonny ^v^
Hello, Thanks Napoleon (and his conquest) all Europeen states use metrics units (ans System International Units). Only unconquest lands and islands ( GB, US) already use non International Units. But, may be they are not a part of the Internationnal World ? (-; (-; (-: (-: (-; (-; (-: (-: (-; (-; (-: (-: (-; (-; (-: (-: (-; (-; (-: (-: (-; (-; (-: (-: (-; (-; (-: (-: (-; (-; (-: (-: (-; (-; (-: (-: Don't be afraid, enter in International System Units Mesurment ! Have a good day, and draw great survey ! Jonny Prouty a écrit :
I have a quick and hopefully simple question. How do I make therion output a loch model with imperial units as opposed to metric? The units in the survey are set to feet, but therion is interpreting them as meters. Any ideas? Thanks in advance!
-Jonny ^v^
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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have a look at the therion book, p13: / *units *. length units supported: meter[s], centimeter[s], inch[es], feet[s], yard[s] (also m, cm, in, ft, yd). Angle units supported: degree[s], minute[s] (also deg, min), grad[s], mil[s], percent[age] (clino only). A degree value may be entered in decimal notation (x:y) or in a special notation for degrees, minutes and seconds (deg[:min[:sec]])./ regards Wolfgang Gilbert Fernandes (mailinglist) schrieb:
Hello,
Thanks Napoleon (and his conquest) all Europeen states use metrics units (ans System International Units). Only unconquest lands and islands ( GB, US) already use non International Units. But, may be they are not a part of the Internationnal World ?
(-; (-; (-: (-: (-; (-; (-: (-: (-; (-; (-: (-: (-; (-; (-: (-: (-; (-; (-: (-: (-; (-; (-: (-: (-; (-; (-: (-: (-; (-; (-: (-: (-; (-; (-: (-:
Don't be afraid, enter in International System Units Mesurment !
Have a good day, and draw great survey !
Jonny Prouty a écrit :
I have a quick and hopefully simple question. How do I make therion output a loch model with imperial units as opposed to metric? The units in the survey are set to feet, but therion is interpreting them as meters. Any ideas? Thanks in advance!
-Jonny ^v^
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Therion mailing list Therion@speleo.sk http://mailman.speleo.sk/mailman/listinfo/therion
Unfortunatelly, this is not yet implemented. I can try to add it - I believe it will not take too much time. I will let you know when done. Regards, S. On Wed, Oct 15, 2008 at 3:33 AM, Jonny Prouty <dormat@gmail.com> wrote:
I have a quick and hopefully simple question. How do I make therion output a loch model with imperial units as opposed to metric? The units in the survey are set to feet, but therion is interpreting them as meters. Any ideas? Thanks in advance!
-Jonny ^v^
_______________________________________________ Therion mailing list Therion@speleo.sk http://mailman.speleo.sk/mailman/listinfo/therion
Thank you Stacho (and Gilbert and Wolfgang)! I would honestly prefer to do everything in metric, but everyone else around here might balk :-(. Unfortunately I'm stuck with feet and miles for the foreseeable future. -Jonny On Wed, Oct 15, 2008 at 2:46 AM, Stacho Mudrak <s.m@group-s.sk> wrote:
Unfortunatelly, this is not yet implemented. I can try to add it - I believe it will not take too much time. I will let you know when done.
Regards, S.
On Wed, Oct 15, 2008 at 3:33 AM, Jonny Prouty <dormat@gmail.com> wrote:
I have a quick and hopefully simple question. How do I make therion output a loch model with imperial units as opposed to metric? The units in the survey are set to feet, but therion is interpreting them as meters. Any ideas? Thanks in advance!
-Jonny ^v^
_______________________________________________ Therion mailing list Therion@speleo.sk http://mailman.speleo.sk/mailman/listinfo/therion
_______________________________________________ Therion mailing list Therion@speleo.sk http://mailman.speleo.sk/mailman/listinfo/therion
Jonny Prouty schrieb:
Thank you Stacho (and Gilbert and Wolfgang)! I would honestly prefer to do everything in metric, but everyone else around here might balk :-(. Unfortunately I'm stuck with feet and miles for the foreseeable future.
-Jonny
in the meantime you could try to use "calibrate" to scale your input (hope this is implemented jet ;-) ) I'm not sure if "cs" in foot are usable (at least for output)? Regards Wolfgang
Thank you for the suggestion, but using calibrate unfortunately scales the survey length as well :-(. The problem is that the centreline is in feet put the passage dimensions are being interpreted as meters, so everything looks ~3 .3 times too big. -Jonny On Wed, Oct 15, 2008 at 11:08 AM, Wolfgang Zillig <wolfgang.zillig@web.de>wrote:
Jonny Prouty schrieb:
Thank you Stacho (and Gilbert and Wolfgang)! I would honestly prefer to do everything in metric, but everyone else around here might balk :-(. Unfortunately I'm stuck with feet and miles for the foreseeable future.
-Jonny
in the meantime you could try to use "calibrate" to scale your input (hope this is implemented jet ;-) ) I'm not sure if "cs" in foot are usable (at least for output)?
Regards Wolfgang
_______________________________________________ Therion mailing list Therion@speleo.sk http://mailman.speleo.sk/mailman/listinfo/therion
I ended up just writing a short perl script that converted all my data to meters, in the original files. On Wed, Oct 15, 2008 at 11:53 AM, Jonny Prouty <dormat@gmail.com> wrote:
Thank you for the suggestion, but using calibrate unfortunately scales the survey length as well :-(. The problem is that the centreline is in feet put the passage dimensions are being interpreted as meters, so everything looks ~3 .3 times too big.
-Jonny
On Wed, Oct 15, 2008 at 11:08 AM, Wolfgang Zillig <wolfgang.zillig@web.de>wrote:
Jonny Prouty schrieb:
Thank you Stacho (and Gilbert and Wolfgang)! I would honestly prefer to do everything in metric, but everyone else around here might balk :-(. Unfortunately I'm stuck with feet and miles for the foreseeable future.
-Jonny
in the meantime you could try to use "calibrate" to scale your input (hope this is implemented jet ;-) ) I'm not sure if "cs" in foot are usable (at least for output)?
Regards Wolfgang
_______________________________________________ Therion mailing list Therion@speleo.sk http://mailman.speleo.sk/mailman/listinfo/therion
OK, first of all, Loch in the newest developement version 5.2.2 (downloadable now) has ability to show models in imperial units. Just configure it with Tools->Options->General settings->Measurement system. But I am not sure, whether it is all you asked for... It looks, that you had problems enering survey data in feet. Is it really like that? Could you please send me some sample file in feets, may be you are just missing units settings. May be your confusion comes from a fact, that if you enter in your data header: units length feet LRUD data are still interpreted as metres. All you need to do in this case is to specify, that also dimenstions are entered in feet units length dimensions feet But probably dimensions units should be set up also when length units are set up. If you agree, I will fix it in therion. Best regards, S. On Wed, Oct 15, 2008 at 2:33 AM, Jonny Prouty <dormat@gmail.com> wrote:
I have a quick and hopefully simple question. How do I make therion output a loch model with imperial units as opposed to metric? The units in the survey are set to feet, but therion is interpreting them as meters. Any ideas? Thanks in advance!
-Jonny ^v^
_______________________________________________ Therion mailing list Therion@speleo.sk http://mailman.speleo.sk/mailman/listinfo/therion
units length feet
LRUD data are still interpreted as metres. All you need to do in this case is to specify, that also dimensions are entered in feet
units length dimensions feet
But probably dimensions units should be set up also when length units are set up. If you agree, I will fix it in therion.
I am happy the way it is, but if change is desired then my vote would be to make dimensions units equal length units unless the user specifically sets both of them to be different to each other. This would allow complete flexibility, and keep it simple for users who only think to set one of them. Same approach could be taken for all length type units (depth, position, etc) Same approach could also be taken for all directional type units (compass, clino etc) Bruce
I agree with Bruce. It would be nice to be able to set global defaults that apply to all units of the same type and the ability to override specific types if necessary. -Jonny On Tue, Nov 4, 2008 at 1:47 AM, Bruce Mutton <bruce.mutton@paradise.net.nz>wrote:
units length feet
LRUD data are still interpreted as metres. All you need to do in this case is to specify, that also dimensions are entered in feet
units length dimensions feet
But probably dimensions units should be set up also when length units are set up. If you agree, I will fix it in therion.
I am happy the way it is, but if change is desired then my vote would be to make dimensions units equal length units unless the user specifically sets both of them to be different to each other. This would allow complete flexibility, and keep it simple for users who only think to set one of them. Same approach could be taken for all length type units (depth, position, etc) Same approach could also be taken for all directional type units (compass, clino etc) Bruce
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Hi, everyone - Taking off from Stacho's comment below about setting the units for LRUD, I have been wrestling ever since I began using Therion with the units on "Passage Height" points. I discovered quite by accident a way to make them come out right, but it seems a kludgy way to do things. In my .th file I specify units like this: units compass degrees units clino degrees units length feet units depth feet units tape feet units altitude feet units dimensions feet Everything should be feet, right?? NOT! When I do a passage height point and specify "-value 3", for example, Therion thinks that is 3 meters. When the map is compiled, 3 meters is converted to feet and then printed on the map. It comes out as 10! point 481.75 -722.5 passage-height -value 3 The workaround I discovered is to specify it as "-value [3 ft]". This comes out right on the compiled map. point 481.75 -722.5 passage-height -value [3 ft] Is there a way to avoid this convoluted syntax? Thanks - Bill Gee I am using Therion 5.2 on Fedora 7
But I am not sure, whether it is all you asked for... It looks, that you had problems enering survey data in feet. Is it really like that? Could you please send me some sample file in feets, may be you are just missing units settings. May be your confusion comes from a fact, that if you enter in your data header:
units length feet
LRUD data are still interpreted as metres. All you need to do in this case is to specify, that also dimenstions are entered in feet
units length dimensions feet
The workaround I discovered is to specify it as "-value [3 ft]". This comes out right on the compiled map.
Good tip Bill. Interestingly, as a user of meters this sort of thing was the reason I gave up on Compass and On-Station, and look with suspicion at anything written by non SI users. Similar problem, but the other way around :) Bruce
units compass degrees units clino degrees units length feet units depth feet units tape feet units altitude feet units dimensions feet
Everything should be feet, right?? NOT! When I do a passage height point and specify "-value 3", for example, Therion thinks that is 3 meters.
You are right, these settings are just for centerline data, and even there in some cases they will not be used (e.g. when specifying explored length after station with continuation flag) :( It needs to be checked and fixed. Until now, nobody was using feets with therion so this problem was ignored.
When the map is compiled, 3 meters is converted to feet and then printed on the map. It comes out as 10!
point 481.75 -722.5 passage-height -value 3
The workaround I discovered is to specify it as "-value [3 ft]". This comes out right on the compiled map.
point 481.75 -722.5 passage-height -value [3 ft]
Is there a way to avoid this convoluted syntax?
Not yet. If it would help you, we can add some -units option for scrap. If it will be specified, all -values in current scrap will be treated in given units. Would this help you? Regards, S.
Hi, Stacho - Yes, this would be a large help! :-) May I suggest an extension of the idea? In the master .th file should be some way of specifying a default for scraps. If the scrap contains a default setting, it over-rides the setting from the .th file. I also think the syntax for setting the units on a specific -value should be retained. It won't be used often, but there will be occasions when it is needed. Thanks - Bill Gee
point 481.75 -722.5 passage-height -value [3 ft]
Is there a way to avoid this convoluted syntax?
Not yet. If it would help you, we can add some -units option for scrap. If it will be specified, all -values in current scrap will be treated in given units. Would this help you?
Regards, S. _______________________________________________ Therion mailing list Therion@speleo.sk http://mailman.speleo.sk/mailman/listinfo/therion
May I suggest an extension of the idea? In the master .th file should be some way of specifying a default for scraps. If the scrap contains a default setting, it over-rides the setting from the .th file.
If it would be specified in master file, than if you will send somebody a part of your data without this master file, he could not be sure, what units did you used. But you are right - units specification for every scrap is still not very convenient... I can imagine. I have another suggestion. What about setting defult units system simmilar way as file character encoding is set. E.g. at the beginning of every file you will have command, that will set default units valid until end of file. This command will be automatically inserted by xtherion each time you create new .th or .th2 file. You will be able to configure default units in xtherion.ini, so you will not have to take care of units any more. And the data will be still portable, because units used in file will be specified in its header. It will also simplify centerline insertion, because units specification after each centerline command will not be needed any more. Regards, S.
I see your point ... Yes, I think your idea is good. :-) Thanks - Bill Gee On Thursday 20 November 2008, Stacho Mudrak wrote:
May I suggest an extension of the idea? In the master .th file should be some way of specifying a default for scraps. If the scrap contains a default setting, it over-rides the setting from the .th file.
If it would be specified in master file, than if you will send somebody a part of your data without this master file, he could not be sure, what units did you used. But you are right - units specification for every scrap is still not very convenient... I can imagine.
I have another suggestion. What about setting defult units system simmilar way as file character encoding is set. E.g. at the beginning of every file you will have command, that will set default units valid until end of file. This command will be automatically inserted by xtherion each time you create new .th or .th2 file. You will be able to configure default units in xtherion.ini, so you will not have to take care of units any more. And the data will be still portable, because units used in file will be specified in its header. It will also simplify centerline insertion, because units specification after each centerline command will not be needed any more.
Regards, S. _______________________________________________ Therion mailing list Therion@speleo.sk http://mailman.speleo.sk/mailman/listinfo/therion
We are also considering to allow direct entering of lengths in feet and inches like 5'3" or 3" (which would be interpreted always as feet/inches regardless of default length units setting). It would simplify code like -value [3 ft] into -value 3'. Any comments on this? How to enter fractions of an inch? Martin On Thu, Nov 20, 2008 at 2:23 PM, Stacho Mudrak <s.m@group-s.sk> wrote:
May I suggest an extension of the idea? In the master .th file should be some way of specifying a default for scraps. If the scrap contains a default setting, it over-rides the setting from the .th file.
If it would be specified in master file, than if you will send somebody a part of your data without this master file, he could not be sure, what units did you used. But you are right - units specification for every scrap is still not very convenient... I can imagine.
I have another suggestion. What about setting defult units system simmilar way as file character encoding is set. E.g. at the beginning of every file you will have command, that will set default units valid until end of file. This command will be automatically inserted by xtherion each time you create new .th or .th2 file. You will be able to configure default units in xtherion.ini, so you will not have to take care of units any more. And the data will be still portable, because units used in file will be specified in its header. It will also simplify centerline insertion, because units specification after each centerline command will not be needed any more.
Regards, S. _______________________________________________ Therion mailing list Therion@speleo.sk http://mailman.speleo.sk/mailman/listinfo/therion
On Mon, Nov 24, 2008 at 5:56 AM, Martin Budaj <m.budaj@gmail.com> wrote:
It would simplify code like -value [3 ft] into -value 3'.
Any comments on this? How to enter fractions of an inch?
-value 3.65' In my experience, it is much more common to encounter "decimal feet" rather than "feet and inches" in American cave survey. DR -- David A. Riggs <david.a.riggs@gmail.com>
I agree with David. Although it would be nice to have the flexibility of entering feet/inches, I think it should be rather low on the priority list. In my somewhat limited experience with cave survey, I have never seen one done in feet/inches. The syntax for fractional inches could be difficult. I suggest it is not really necessary. In working with feet/tenths, I almost never take a measurement closer than the nearest tenth of a foot. That is slightly more than an inch, so measurements to the nearest inch would be about the same accuracy. Bill Gee On Monday 24 November 2008, David A. Riggs wrote:
On Mon, Nov 24, 2008 at 5:56 AM, Martin Budaj <m.budaj@gmail.com> wrote:
It would simplify code like -value [3 ft] into -value 3'.
Any comments on this? How to enter fractions of an inch?
-value 3.65'
In my experience, it is much more common to encounter "decimal feet" rather than "feet and inches" in American cave survey.
DR
participants (8)
-
Bill Gee -
Bruce Mutton -
David A. Riggs -
Gilbert Fernandes (mailinglist) -
Jonny Prouty -
Martin Budaj -
Stacho Mudrak -
Wolfgang Zillig