- Therion - speleo.sk

topodroid to therion
by Marco Corvi 04 Dec '18

04 Dec '18

*The meaning I meant to convey was; I don’t think I have seen a description of exactly the settings and workflow TopoDROID users should use if they want to export their data for Therion to process, in one place, and step by step. No doubt the detail is in the TopoDROID user manual, but it is scattered around, and interspersed with information that is not particularly useful for Therion users.* bruce, you are right. i misunderstood. a therion wiki page, a sort of "howto use topodroid for therion", is probably a good idea *And little indication of what settings will make life pleasant or unpleasant for Therion users. Many of the default settings seem to be Therion unfriendly, as evidenced by the examples posted on the Therion forum over the previous year or so, and my own subsequent experimentations.* this is probably because the default values of topodroid settings try to fit the average cave surveyor/cartographer, and only a minority of them uses therion. anyways, i think that the therion-relevant settings are only a few *I suspect what is missing is a user guide that describes what to do to ensure a pleasant Therion experience with data generated by TopoDROID. Your post from 3-4 December is the first time I recall seeing such a targeted user guide format, and I am wondering if a Therion wiki page based on your post might fill that gap. * however, i do not expect my way to be the best and the only one. i do not think there is a definitive way to work from topodroid to therion. the process depends also on the environment (=cave) and resources (=android device/distox). the wiki page might provide general rules and point to program features that are important for the drafting of maps with therion and cave project managing. * I am happy to create the outline of a wiki page and fit it into the Therion wiki structure somehow. If I start something, maybe someone else can fill in the gaps* as i said, i think it's a good idea. do it. and i hope other users add in their advices marco

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topodroid to therion
by Bruce Mutton 04 Dec '18

04 Dec '18

Hi Marco Ah, so midline = the set of legs = centreline! >>That is a good description. I can see a wiki page developing from it. I don’t think I have seen similar information before? > that info is in the user manual, more or less The meaning I meant to convey was; I don’t think I have seen a description of exactly the settings and workflow TopoDROID users should use if they want to export their data for Therion to process, in one place, and step by step. No doubt the detail is in the TopoDROID user manual, but it is scattered around, and interspersed with information that is not particularly useful for Therion users. And little indication of what settings will make life pleasant or unpleasant for Therion users. Many of the default settings seem to be Therion unfriendly, as evidenced by the examples posted on the Therion forum over the previous year or so, and my own subsequent experimentations. I suspect what is missing is a user guide that describes what to do to ensure a pleasant Therion experience with data generated by TopoDROID. Your post from 3-4 December is the first time I recall seeing such a targeted user guide format, and I am wondering if a Therion wiki page based on your post might fill that gap. I am happy to create the outline of a wiki page and fit it into the Therion wiki structure somehow. If I start something, maybe someone else can fill in the gaps? Regards Bruce

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topodroid to therion
by Marco Corvi 03 Dec '18

03 Dec '18

i apologize the cut-n-paste, but i get post in digest and i try to keep reply short. - - - - - - That is a good description. I can see a wiki page developing from it. I don’t think I have seen similar information before? that info is in the user manual, more or less It is a while since I played with TopoDROID. Is it the intention that one TopoDROID sketch produces, or is equivalent to, one matching pair of Therion scraps (plan and elevation)? yes, initially sketches were saved as th2 files. then i realized users were drawing huge sketches (well over 1 km), so i turned to a binary format (and a cache) to speed up opening (and saving) the sketches I am interested in the data naming conventions you use, to facilitate the tracing of parent and child object relationships (ie data files (TopoDROID and Therion) through to survey and scrap, for example). the survey name is the base name. sketches append their name to that of the survey, separated by a dash, and with suffix 'p' or 's' survey name and sketch names can be chosen by the user (topodroid suggest numbers for sketch names). cross-section names are chosen by topodroid (eg "xx1" etc; there are four patterns, if i'm not mistaken, for four different types of cross-section) scraps take the name from the file the xvi scale is almost 1:39.37 (the exact number is somewhere in therion sources) an exported data file (.th) contains input for all its sketches (.th2 files), and map commands. however these are all under comment. topodroid does not create the thconfig file And I should just check exactly what you mean by ‘mid-line’? I have always been guessing. Is it the survey shot line that goes from ‘from station’ to ‘to station’? midline = the set of legs marco

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locating where scrap outline intersects itself, and understanding the metapost log
by Thorir Jonsson 03 Dec '18

03 Dec '18

Hi! I'm still having issues generating a pdf from my survey. Maybe it is because of the size of the scrap but I have not yet figured out how to work with multiple scraps so I hope I can make this work as a single scrap. The metapost log tells me that the scrap outline intersects itself, but does not give any indication of where this happens. How can I find out what is amiss? Right after the outline intersecting error I get the following: ! Value is too large (7219). <for(picture)> q:=pathpart(EXPR0);tmp:=length.q; s:=decimal(roundone(xpart.po... draw_downscrap->...te.s.to.clip_name;endfor;endfor ;write"closepath fill"to.b... l.14260 draw_downscrap ; I must confess I have no idea what this is trying to tell me. What value is too large? Why is the text formatted so strangely? Do the ellipses indicate where text has been clipped, and if so where can I find the full text? I'm running Therion on Fedora 27 if that matters. Here is the full text from the log: therion 5.4.1 (2017-04-18) initialization file: /etc/therion.ini reading ... done checking optional fonts csr10 csti10 csbx10 csss10 csssi10 ... NOT INSTALLED checking optional fonts cmcyr10 cmcti10 cmcbx10 cmcss10 cmcssi10 ... OK configuration file: thconfig.thc reading ... done reading source files ... done preprocessing database ... done output coordinate system: UTM28 meridian convergence (deg): 2.6969 geomag declinations (deg): 2016.1.1 -12.1246 2017.1.1 -11.8581 scanning centreline tree ... done searching for centerline loops ... done calculating station coordinates ... done calculating basic statistics ... done processing extended elevation ... done processing references ... done selecting export objects ... done processing projection plan ... done average distortion: 0.03% writing litrikur.pdf ... ####################### metapost log file ######################## This is MetaPost, version 1.9991 (TeX Live 2016) (kpathsea version 6.2.2) 3 DEC 2018 13:17 **data.mp (/usr/share/texlive/texmf-dist/metapost/base/mpost.mp (/usr/share/texlive/texmf-dist/metapost/base/plain.mp Preloading the plain mem file, version 1.005) ) (./data.mp [4001] [4002] [4003] [4004] [4005] [4006] [4007] [4008] [4009] [4010] [4011] [4012] [4013] [1] [Warning: scrap outline intersects itself in scrap Litrikur-1p@Litrikur] ! Value is too large (7219). <for(picture)> q:=pathpart(EXPR0);tmp:=length.q; s:=decimal(roundone(xpart.po... draw_downscrap->...te.s.to.clip_name;endfor;endfor ;write"closepath fill"to.b... l.14260 draw_downscrap ; The equation I just processed has given some variable a value outside of the safetyp range. Continue and I'll try to cope with that big value; but it might be dangerous. (Set warningcheck:=0 to suppress this message.) [2] [3] [4] (./mptextmp.mp) [5] ) Here is how much of MetaPost's memory you used: 138534 strings using 3746717 characters 6847656 bytes of node memory 1422 symbolic tokens 11i,81n,14p,226b,5f stack positions out of 16i,96n,17p,250b,6f 18 output files written: data.1 .. data.4013 #################### end of metapost log file #################### therion: error -- metapost exit code -- 512 writing xtherion file ... done

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Line artifact on scrap
by Thorir Jonsson 02 Dec '18

02 Dec '18

I have a strange artifact on a scrap I am working on, that I can't seem to select or get rid of (see attached screenshot). It is always drawn in red and no matter what I do I can't select it or get rid of it. Any Ideas as to what might have caused this or how I can remove it? Cheers, Þórir Már

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TopoDROID to Therion process with respect to scraps
by Bruce Mutton 02 Dec '18

02 Dec '18

If I may ask a question unrelated to Thorir’s original post topic … > try to make shorter scraps. There is no problem if you’ll create many short scraps. I agree with Martin’s statement above, however I wonder how to approach it if the survey data and drawing was created with TopoDROID, as it appears Thorir’s example was. Is there a workflow that is easy to use with ‘TopoDROID to Therion’ process, that also allows more than one scrap per survey trip file? With limited experimentation (and making assumption that TopoDROID ‘sketches’ might be approximately equivalent to Therion ‘scraps’), I have not yet found a way that is easy to implement and encourages a naming convention that eases tracing of scraps to their parent TopoDROID file. And breaking existing scraps into smaller scraps is a task I find unnecessarily tedious, when one could just have drawn smaller scraps in the first place. Am I missing something obvious? What are experienced Therion users who subsequently became proficient with TopoDROID as a data collector doing in this space? Bruce

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Metapost
by Pavel Herich 26 Nov '18

26 Nov '18

Hi all, I look for code of "snail shell" written in metapost, to use it as point u (for organodetritic limestone layers), but I am not able to find anything, as well I haven´t any skills to write it by myself. Does anybody posses this kind of code? Thank you Pavel

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Background zoom-level bug
by Wookey 15 Nov '18

15 Nov '18

There seems to be a bug in xtherion graphics editor revealed if you manage to enter a non-power-of-two zoom level. If you get into this state then the background image and the lines drawn on top of it go out of registration. Here is an easy way to reproduce the problem. You will need a mouse with a scroll-wheel, and the latest 5.4.1 version of therion.. * Insert a jpeg into a new .th2 file in xtherion. * Draw a line over part of it. * Move it around and observe that the line moves with the background. This is true at all 5 fixed zoom levels. * zoom with the mouse scroll button as far out as possible. It seems to allow 12% for example. Now when you come back out you get 24%, 48%, 96% etc. * Now if you move the image around, the image and lines stay together until you have moved a bit, but then start to move seprately. This seems to be something to do with bounding boxes. * Click on 25/50/100/200/400 scaling the line+ images go back into registration. I can't reproduce this problem right now because my therion is too old, so the mouse wheel doesn't produce scrolling in the xtherion window, but we had the same problem on both Windows and Linux machines at the weekend with 5.4.1. If others can confirm that the above is a sufficient set of instructions, then hopefully someone with clue can work out why it goes wrong for 'intermediate' zoom levels. It took us quite a while to work out what on earth was going on at the weekend! Wookey -- Principal hats: Linaro, Debian, Wookware, ARM http://wookware.org/

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Add Coordinate data back at last level of Survey Hierarchy?
by alastair gott 15 Nov '18

15 Nov '18

HI, I was trying to join a file [with Centreline driven by .3d data (.3d)] to another file [with centreline driven by my electronic surveying data (Elec)]. The .3d file seems to come with it's own coordinate system, so we needed to remove(#) the entrance coordinates, from the Elec data. I have joined these two surveys in a .th file and successfully got an output. There are two entrances to the system. So my question is, can I add back coordinate data for one (or more) Entrance(s) at the last level of the survey hierarchy? or will the mismatch between .3d and Elec prevent me from doing this? Regards, Alastair Gott. AlastairGott(a)hotmail.com, M: 07931779380,

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mark [(Station list)] <type>
by Torsten Schnitter 14 Nov '18

14 Nov '18

Hi Can sombody explain what the switch: mark [(station list)] <type> from the command centreline does!? As <type> one of the following ist allowed: temporary (default) painted natural fixed I can't find an example and therefore do not understand the meaning of this switch. Thanks! regards, Torsten

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