Nick Bairstow wrote: "I have been giving some thought to producing a tutorial to follow on from Footlegs wiki item. Unfortunately it's not a simple as I first thought. Over the next few months I will attempt to come up with something that will enable a novice therioneer understand the next steps following the Footleg wiki article. It would be nice to continue using Bull Pot as the sample cave but I have not got time to re-survey that so I propose we use an existing data set which could become the default novice reference. It seems many people give up with Therion as it is difficult to learn but with a good tutorial and a little help many more could be using it. What do people think, am I wasting my time, comments please. Oh and if someone else is already doing something similar please shout up. No point doing it twice." I use Footleg's tutorial a lot. If you are not using a program every day, then having a handy known reference point for the details is always a good thing. It doesn't cover every single aspect, so if Nick wants to add further material, I for one would be delighted. Please do it, Nick. The other main trick for learning in this way is "How did we do this last time?" or looking back at a previous data set, your own or someone else's, and seeing how it works. If there was a reference data set available (if not on the Therion wiki but on the cave-registry page, perhaps) then the tutorial could certainly link to that. Of course 'live' data can change over time, so having a fixed example set might be better. Bear in mind that data for a single cave is insufficient to cover all problems. We routinely combine data from different caves, because they are close together or, as has been done several times, to produce a context overview to show a cave in relation to its neighbours and the land surface. See, for example, the thing below the caption in the latest version of the Gough's Cave survey http://www.ubss.org.uk/resources/surveys/survex/Goughs_all.pdf . Does anyone have a good multi-cave dataset that is now stable and so can be used for this purpose? It is also worth remembering, of course, that different people do some things differently, an example data set might enshrine work habits that are not the same as mine or yours. Graham