Hello, I have one more question about Therion. Is it possible to add some data gotten from a hidroniveler (I don't know is it correct in english ;/ ) to any survey? The question came out of the situation we have now: once we've done a cave survey we realized that there could be quite big relational error. That's because the cave is very narrow - it is very diffucult to measure clino and azimuth. That's why we are going to use hidroniveler. At least to know exact depth of the cave. I would be greate to have a possibility to add such data to therion survey source. I'm sorry if I made my self unclear. Please let me know. Vilius A. Speleoclub "Ænigma" www.speleo.lt
On 5.8.2007, at 19:08, Vilius A wrote:
At least to know exact depth of the cave. I would be greate to have a possibility to add such data to therion survey source.
Anyway you may use style "diving" for style of your input data. For example: data diving from to compass length depth Martin
On Sunday 2007 August 05 20:29:06 Martin Sluka wrote:
On 5.8.2007, at 19:08, Vilius A wrote:
At least to know exact depth of the cave. I would be greate to have a possibility to add such data to therion survey source.
Anyway you may use style "diving" for style of your input data.
For example:
data diving from to compass length depth
Martin _______________________________________________ Therion mailing list Therion@speleo.sk http://www.speleo.sk/mailman/listinfo/therion
You see, that would be probably fine... Just I see it like that: I have 20 shots from 0 to 20. Each with very high relational error >10% (lets say because of difficult circumstances). And if total depth of those shots is 20m we have at least ±2m. So if we have hidroniveler data that real depth is 21m. we can add it to survey source and adjust centerline and each shot to real depth. In this example it would be like this (as I imagine it ;D ): (REAL_DEPTH - MEASURED_DEPTH)/SHOTS_COUNT=DIFFERENCE ...and we add this average DIFFERENCE to each shot to make it more exact than previous numbers. Acutally the same thing we are going to do by hand. Syntax as I imagine could be like this: ##### data depth from to depth 0 20 -21 ##### How it would be done the way with "data diving..." Is it similar or not? Vilius A. Speleoclub "Ænigma" www.speleo.lt
On 6.8.2007, at 0:01, Vilius A wrote:
How it would be done the way with "data diving..." Is it similar or not?
I'm sorry, it is nor very clear to me. You may use for each single row of measurement quite different style. For example: data normal from to compass length clino 1 2 125 4.8 -15 2 3 172 3.1 -11 data diving from to compass length depth 3 4 261 4.8 -6.5 data normal to from clino compass length right left up down 5 4 -5 141 14.7 0.5 0 2 1 etc. You may change the units of measurements in the same way too. For example if you measure only part of surveying in grads (400°). Martin
Quoting Vilius A <vilyzzz@gmail.com>:
Syntax as I imagine could be like this: ##### data depth from to depth 0 20 -21 #####
How it would be done the way with "data diving..." Is it similar or not?
I am not sure, whether it will work, but you may add additional duplicate shot between stations 0 and 20 with this exact depth. The problem is, that you need to enter also horizontal component of this shot (means compass reading or dx+dy). I think, the best way is to set large standard deviation for clino to your shots (using SD command) and then add additional "cartesian" shot from 0 to 20 with large SD for DX and DY and small SD for DZ example: data normal from to compass clino tape sd clino 20 deg # means 70% of readings are +- 20 degrees, big error 0 1 ... 1 2 ... 19 20 ... data cartesian from to dx dy dz sd dx dy 20 m # big error for DX and DY sd dz 0.01 m # small error for DZ 0 20 50 50 -21 instead of 50 50, try to use as precise DX and DY as possible between stations 0 and 20. For more details, see manual for Survex. HTH, S.
I think a "hidroniveler" must be a barometer in English: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barometer On Mon, Aug 06, 2007 at 08:47:43AM +0200, Stacho Mudrak wrote:
I am not sure, whether it will work, but you may add additional duplicate shot between stations 0 and 20 with this exact depth. The problem is, that you need to enter also horizontal component of this shot (means compass reading or dx+dy).
I think, the best way is to set large standard deviation for clino to your shots (using SD command) and then add additional "cartesian" shot from 0 to 20 with large SD for DX and DY and small SD for DZ example:
This is currently the best you can really do, but it's certainly not ideal. There ought to be a way to represent survey information which only establishes a vertical relationship between two stations. Similarly for purely horizontal information - for example, some GPS units don't store the altitude of waypoints. This has actually been on the Survex TODO list for ages, but the focus has generally been on features which users actually want and I think you're the first person to actually ask about it! Cheers, Olly
On 2007-08-23 01:53 +0100, Olly Betts wrote:
I think a "hidroniveler" must be a barometer in English
I think it is actually a 'hydrolevel', which is a specialised version of a barometer/altimeter/depth gauge. These all funamentally amount to the same thing so far as survex is concerned either absolute or difference height readings, although in practice their readings may come in different forms which need to be allowed for (such as absolute vs difference). Certainly the calibration requirements for high-altitude hyrdolevelling are quite different from those for conventional instruments. For details See the (evolving) article on Hydrolevelling Krubera in various journals: AMCS Activities Newsletter, no. 29, October 2006 issue of Compass and Tape (vol. 17, no.3, issue 59), Summary in Compass Points 36, and (IIRC) a less geeky version in a recent Speleology (but not the #8 I can lay my hands on right now), and a forthcoming one in CP 38 wih more of the tech details in. Wookey -- Principal hats: Balloonz - Toby Churchill - Aleph One - Debian http://wookware.org/
participants (5)
-
Martin Sluka -
Olly Betts -
Stacho Mudrak -
Vilius A -
Wookey