Thanks Bruce, I seem to have missed this last year. I have read through your report and your stuff on the wiki several times and I think I now understand what I have been doing and why things have worked or not worked. Applying this new knowledge will enable us to develop our dataset in a more controlled manner, I just wish I'd worked this out two years ago. What seemed simple at the time slowly becomes more complex as you add more stuff. Thanks to everyone for their input. Nick From: Therion [mailto:therion-bounces@speleo.sk] On Behalf Of Bruce Mutton via Therion Sent: 02 March 2018 21:11 To: 'List for Therion users' <therion@speleo.sk> Cc: Bruce Mutton <bruce@tomo.co.nz> Subject: [Therion] Error When Adding A new Cave to Master Index - Therion Theory Nick This may or may not help, but you have stumbled, in part, into a topic I explored back in July 2017 (if seems much longer than that), with mixed feedback! https://www.mail-archive.com/therion@speleo.sk/msg06555.html At the time I made some changes based on feedback received. I have not looked at it for a while, but have attached the file in its current state, with changes tracked. It is still a bit rough I'm sorry. Bruce From: Therion <therion-bounces@speleo.sk<mailto:therion-bounces@speleo.sk>> On Behalf Of Nick Bairstow via Therion Sent: Friday, 2 March 2018 11:01 PM To: List for Therion users <therion@speleo.sk<mailto:therion@speleo.sk>> Cc: Nick Bairstow <Nick@pff.uk.com<mailto:Nick@pff.uk.com>> Subject: Re: [Therion] Error When Adding A new Cave to Master Index OK as is normally the case with these things I spotted the error within five minutes of asking for help, but it has raised a another question. My problem was quite simply I had no survey/end survey wrapper. I have been using this index file for over two years and never noticed however it has worked perfectly and produced what I needed. I now ask why did the index.th compile OK with the other 18 surveys listed in it. The only difference between the first 18 surveys and the last non-working one was that in each scrap of the 18 previous surveys I used the option -station-names "" "@surveyname". I was shown this when I started learning Therion but never really new why. When using this option to make any survey.th compile I have to make sure the map/endmap is outside the survey/endsurvey wrapper. With the my latest survey file I did not use the scrap option and just went with the "normal way" with everything in survey.th within the survey/endsurvey and then the index .th failed due to having no survey/endsurvey wrapper. Clearly I do not yet fully understand the process even though I can make things work, so lots more reading I think. Does anyone know of a good explanation somewhere, most thing I read I find a little confusing. Also if someone would like to explain the -station-names "" "@surveyname" bit I would be very grateful. I suspect I'm not the only one to have struggled with this. Thanks for the previous answers guys. Nick From: Therion [mailto:therion-bounces@speleo.sk] On Behalf Of Bruce Mutton via Therion Sent: 01 March 2018 19:23 To: 'List for Therion users' <therion@speleo.sk<mailto:therion@speleo.sk>> Cc: Bruce Mutton <bruce@tomo.co.nz<mailto:bruce@tomo.co.nz>> Subject: Re: [Therion] Error When Adding A new Cave to Master Index Nick I'm guessing you have created a map that contains the survey only for your new cave, and a map which contains scraps or maps for your other caves. I do this intentionally while I am drawing up a new piece of passage, then remove the survey map once I am finished. Bruce From: Therion <therion-bounces@speleo.sk<mailto:therion-bounces@speleo.sk>> On Behalf Of Nick Bairstow via Therion Sent: Friday, 2 March 2018 7:38 AM To: List for Therion users <therion@speleo.sk<mailto:therion@speleo.sk>> Cc: Nick Bairstow <Nick@pff.uk.com<mailto:Nick@pff.uk.com>> Subject: [Therion] Error When Adding A new Cave to Master Index I have just added a small cave to my main index .th. Everything compiles but the pdf shows the new cave as shots and splays not as the normal walls etc you would expect in a map. All other caves display correctly as intended. Has anyone point out what I am doing wrong. Nick