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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Martin<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>While the information that you just posted
from the Therion Book is accurate and helped me in some way get started, in
that the data structure I use follows a similar ‘system’, it is
only once I have my ‘system’ working that I can see that what I
have done in fact follows the Therion Book. Does that make sense?<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>As a new user a diagrammatic illustration
of the ‘structure’ and perhaps itemized lists of what goes where,
with some comprehensive example batch file contents would have helped me, and
still would. (The simple examples that are available are necessary and
helpful however – for illustrating one aspect at a time – without the
clutter of other things going on)<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>From some of the questions asked on this
forum over the last six months, and the forum link that Jonathan provided </span></font><font
size=2 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'><a
href="http://forums.caves.org/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=6757&p=55739">http://forums.caves.org/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=6757&p=55739</a>
</span></font><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial;color:navy'>it would seem there are other users for which the
same would apply. It would seem to me that Bill Gee either had some extremely
bad luck, or is overstating his skill base. I have a fraction of his computer
experience and have been lucky enough to have had fewer problems even though I
started on a relatively large and complex cave system. He does seem to
have tried quite a lot though – very comprehensive questions…<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Jonathan, His unanswered questions
regarding cross section orientation and joining scraps are well explained in
the Wiki, Wookies article, and this forum as I recall. If scrap outlines
overlap themselves, it’s either because you haven’t finished
drawing the scrap (open ends of passage very far apart with the wall wiggling
out through the ‘opening’) or because the ‘drag handles’
from adjacent points ‘overlap’ each other. (Not always a problem,
but often is, after ‘join’ morphing has added extra distortion to
the Bezier curves)<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Regarding his units troubles. The
funny thing is that Compass and On-Station give me the same trouble, and
Therion never has. At least Therion stores the input data as the user
enters it – makes it easier to pin point bugs or user errors.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Any way, back to the topic: Therion Data
Structures. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I’m putting something together for
my own use, (‘cos it won’t all fit in my head) but the details are
evolving quite rapidly, as I gain more experience, try new things, and learn
new tricks. I’ll post it here or on the Wiki if I can figure out
how to. Won’t be for some months perhaps…<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I still haven’t seen anything
written about Walls or Tunnel that would make me try them… Well, I
would try Walls, but it wouldn’t download, and now I like Therion for its
conceptual simplicity, even if user error detection can be a bit complex.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>From the Tunnel website…<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:6.0pt;line-height:18.0pt;background:
white'><font size=4 color=black face=Arial><span lang=EN style='font-size:12.5pt;
font-family:Arial;color:black'>The disadvantages of Tunnel's way are as
follows: <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:1.2pt;
margin-left:38.4pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;line-height:18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1;
background:white'><![if !supportLists]><font size=4 color=black face=Arial><span
lang=EN style='font-size:12.5pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'><span
style='mso-list:Ignore'>1.<font size=1 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> </span></font></span></span></font><![endif]><font
size=4 color=black face=Arial><span lang=EN style='font-size:12.5pt;font-family:
Arial;color:black'>You have to do a lot of extra editing just to join in a new
piece of the survey. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:1.2pt;
margin-left:38.4pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;line-height:18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1;
background:white'><![if !supportLists]><font size=4 color=black face=Arial><span
lang=EN style='font-size:12.5pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'><span
style='mso-list:Ignore'>2.<font size=1 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> </span></font></span></span></font><![endif]><font
size=4 color=black face=Arial><span lang=EN style='font-size:12.5pt;font-family:
Arial;color:black'>You wind up with multiple copies of the same piece of cave
in your workspace. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:1.2pt;
margin-left:38.4pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;line-height:18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1;
background:white'><![if !supportLists]><font size=4 color=black face=Arial><span
lang=EN style='font-size:12.5pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'><span
style='mso-list:Ignore'>3.<font size=1 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> </span></font></span></span></font><![endif]><font
size=4 color=black face=Arial><span lang=EN style='font-size:12.5pt;font-family:
Arial;color:black'>You lose the connection to the original drawings so you
can't correct them in the original state and see the changes in the final
drawing. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:1.2pt;
margin-left:38.4pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;line-height:18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1;
background:white'><![if !supportLists]><font size=4 color=black face=Arial><span
lang=EN style='font-size:12.5pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'><span
style='mso-list:Ignore'>4.<font size=1 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> </span></font></span></span></font><![endif]><font
size=4 color=black face=Arial><span lang=EN style='font-size:12.5pt;font-family:
Arial;color:black'>It's not known how many times a survey could be copied and
morphed before unexpected errors of distortion would become a problem. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-left:38.4pt;
text-indent:-18.0pt;line-height:18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1;background:white'><![if !supportLists]><font
size=4 color=black face=Arial><span lang=EN style='font-size:12.5pt;font-family:
Arial;color:black'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>5.<font size=1
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>
</span></font></span></span></font><![endif]><font size=4 color=black
face=Arial><span lang=EN style='font-size:12.5pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>The
files for a large survey can become rather large. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I seem to remember that the Tunnel web
site ‘said’ it could not do elevation projections, as of a couple
of months ago, but I can not find that just now. Anyway, alpine caves need
elevation projections, so Tunnel would seem to be no good for me.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Keep up the good work.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Bruce<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabindex=-1>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
therion-bounces@speleo.sk [mailto:therion-bounces@speleo.sk] <b><span
style='font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Martin Sluka<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Monday, 28 April 2008 5:48
a.m.<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> <st1:PersonName w:st="on">therion@speleo.sk</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [Therion] Hopefully a
bunch of new users; Optimum Data Managment</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>On 23.4.2008, at 10:32, marco corvi wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p style='margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><font size=1 face=Helvetica><span
style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Helvetica'>maps hierarchies to organize the
scraps, and select/unselect to<span class=apple-converted-space> </span></span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p style='margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><font size=1 face=Helvetica><span
style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Helvetica'>specify what to export</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Two section regarding organization of data from therion book:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>m.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
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<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=1 face=Helvetica><span style='font-size:9.0pt;
font-family:Helvetica'>How to enter centreline?</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=1 color=navy face=Helvetica><span
style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Helvetica;color:navy'>Text deleted …</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=1 face=Helvetica><span style='font-size:9.0pt;
font-family:Helvetica'>How to draw maps?</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=1 color=navy face=Helvetica><span
style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:Helvetica;color:navy'>Text deleted …</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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