Re: [Therion] Connection of Really straight mine level to surveyed passage
Hi Alistair I would definitely link all the survey centrelines. The implication is that you have some errors in the survey, but you know that the straight mine level needs to be straight so the error isn’t there. One thing you could try is to set the SD for the level to be very low, and the SD for the rest of the cave to be quite high. When Therion distributes the error, most of this should go to the survey sections either the highest SD, and the level should be less distorted. Best regards Ben Sent from my iPhone
On 14 Nov 2020, at 11:49, alastair gott <alastairgott@hotmail.com> wrote: HI Therion people,
I'm helping with a project we've got a cave/mine system with a really straight mine level for one of the entrances, which we have the centreline data for (but no sketches to show where the points are).
When the system was joined up together with all the entrances there was a kink in the mine level. so to counteract this, I removed some of the unknown survey points in the centre of the level and hung the survey on some points at the beginning and end of the level.
I now want to add in a section of cave in the centre of the level. I have connected this quite well in a map at a lower level with just the one entrance coordinates in it, but when I run the full map with all the entrances in, the model then tries to remove the loop error by doing it's statisical wizardry.
Unfortunately in doing so, it shifts the start of the level (the entrance) to the east. and then leaves the section of cave out unconnected.
If anyone can help, then the config for the full system is here: http://www.cave-registry.org.uk/svn/PeakDistrict/Castleton/peak_speedwell_mo...
This is what I get:
<image.png>
the config for the one entrance coordinate is here: http://www.cave-registry.org.uk/svn/PeakDistrict/Castleton/peak_speedwell_mo...
and these are the two selects if you want to run it at the lower level: select bottomless_pit.speedwell_mine select oakden_level.speedwell_mine This is what I want:
<image.png>
If I add in a survey point to hook it to, then I get this: <image.png>
Rather than this: <image.png>
Adding in more survey points further down the passage to the south only increases the amount of distortion in a small space of passage. as there are three loop closures at the bottom of the picture [just below the red circle) which the model is running (i've just not included the maps on the drawing for clarity).
Regards, Alastair Gott.
AlastairGott@hotmail.com, M: 07931779380. _______________________________________________ Therion mailing list Therion@speleo.sk https://mailman.speleo.sk/listinfo/therion
Another option would be to get the coordinates of the linking mine station and fixing it, and just giving that station a „perfect“ Standards deviation (isn’t that default if not given?)
Am 14.11.2020 um 21:29 schrieb Ben Cooper <ben@caver.plus.com>:
Hi Alistair I would definitely link all the survey centrelines. The implication is that you have some errors in the survey, but you know that the straight mine level needs to be straight so the error isn’t there. One thing you could try is to set the SD for the level to be very low, and the SD for the rest of the cave to be quite high. When Therion distributes the error, most of this should go to the survey sections either the highest SD, and the level should be less distorted. Best regards Ben
Sent from my iPhone
On 14 Nov 2020, at 11:49, alastair gott <alastairgott@hotmail.com> wrote:
HI Therion people,
I'm helping with a project we've got a cave/mine system with a really straight mine level for one of the entrances, which we have the centreline data for (but no sketches to show where the points are).
When the system was joined up together with all the entrances there was a kink in the mine level. so to counteract this, I removed some of the unknown survey points in the centre of the level and hung the survey on some points at the beginning and end of the level.
I now want to add in a section of cave in the centre of the level. I have connected this quite well in a map at a lower level with just the one entrance coordinates in it, but when I run the full map with all the entrances in, the model then tries to remove the loop error by doing it's statisical wizardry.
Unfortunately in doing so, it shifts the start of the level (the entrance) to the east. and then leaves the section of cave out unconnected.
If anyone can help, then the config for the full system is here: http://www.cave-registry.org.uk/svn/PeakDistrict/Castleton/peak_speedwell_mo...
This is what I get:
<image.png>
the config for the one entrance coordinate is here: http://www.cave-registry.org.uk/svn/PeakDistrict/Castleton/peak_speedwell_mo...
and these are the two selects if you want to run it at the lower level: select bottomless_pit.speedwell_mine select oakden_level.speedwell_mine This is what I want:
<image.png>
If I add in a survey point to hook it to, then I get this: <image.png>
Rather than this: <image.png>
Adding in more survey points further down the passage to the south only increases the amount of distortion in a small space of passage. as there are three loop closures at the bottom of the picture [just below the red circle) which the model is running (i've just not included the maps on the drawing for clarity).
Regards, Alastair Gott.
AlastairGott@hotmail.com, M: 07931779380. _______________________________________________ Therion mailing list Therion@speleo.sk https://mailman.speleo.sk/listinfo/therion
Therion mailing list Therion@speleo.sk https://mailman.speleo.sk/listinfo/therion
HI Beni and Ben, I have applied those fixes, it's looking much better now i've applied the following to the mine level and added the points back in. "centreline grade UISv1_5 sd position 1 m sd x 1 m sd y 1 m" I have also changed the survey grade of some of the loop closure passages to be grade UISv1_3, which has helped loosen them up a little. I've asked the person i'm helping whether we can apply the grade 3 fix to some more passages, but I think we'll have to choose wisely which we alter with this fix. But I guess therion/survex is already applying this fix anyway, so it would be better for us to choose where it tightens and loosens the loop closer. Thank you for the suggestions, I'll try and let you know how it goes. Regards, Alastair Gott. AlastairGott@hotmail.com, M: 07931779380. ________________________________ From: Therion <therion-bounces@speleo.sk> on behalf of Benedikt Hallinger <beni@hallinger.org> Sent: 15 November 2020 08:09 To: List for Therion users <therion@speleo.sk> Subject: Re: [Therion] Connection of Really straight mine level to surveyed passage Another option would be to get the coordinates of the linking mine station and fixing it, and just giving that station a „perfect“ Standards deviation (isn’t that default if not given?) Am 14.11.2020 um 21:29 schrieb Ben Cooper <ben@caver.plus.com>: Hi Alistair I would definitely link all the survey centrelines. The implication is that you have some errors in the survey, but you know that the straight mine level needs to be straight so the error isn’t there. One thing you could try is to set the SD for the level to be very low, and the SD for the rest of the cave to be quite high. When Therion distributes the error, most of this should go to the survey sections either the highest SD, and the level should be less distorted. Best regards Ben Sent from my iPhone On 14 Nov 2020, at 11:49, alastair gott <alastairgott@hotmail.com> wrote: HI Therion people, I'm helping with a project we've got a cave/mine system with a really straight mine level for one of the entrances, which we have the centreline data for (but no sketches to show where the points are). When the system was joined up together with all the entrances there was a kink in the mine level. so to counteract this, I removed some of the unknown survey points in the centre of the level and hung the survey on some points at the beginning and end of the level. I now want to add in a section of cave in the centre of the level. I have connected this quite well in a map at a lower level with just the one entrance coordinates in it, but when I run the full map with all the entrances in, the model then tries to remove the loop error by doing it's statisical wizardry. Unfortunately in doing so, it shifts the start of the level (the entrance) to the east. and then leaves the section of cave out unconnected. If anyone can help, then the config for the full system is here: http://www.cave-registry.org.uk/svn/PeakDistrict/Castleton/peak_speedwell_model/<https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cave-registry.org.uk%2Fsvn%2FPeakDistrict%2FCastleton%2Fpeak_speedwell_model%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C1f1e9dd467c24016498a08d8893df764%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637410246519365911%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=ZPk8DRBXvmSvvJYqFyWGU15PCQsMqQ1nuM6UFMcRpWY%3D&reserved=0> This is what I get: <image.png> the config for the one entrance coordinate is here: http://www.cave-registry.org.uk/svn/PeakDistrict/Castleton/peak_speedwell_model/speedwell_mine/Speedwell_mine_thconfig.thc<https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cave-registry.org.uk%2Fsvn%2FPeakDistrict%2FCastleton%2Fpeak_speedwell_model%2Fspeedwell_mine%2FSpeedwell_mine_thconfig.thc&data=04%7C01%7C%7C1f1e9dd467c24016498a08d8893df764%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637410246519365911%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=AfKnso9AUbw0UzNSOYJxjwjf4edH7jnEqshbUCsBE44%3D&reserved=0> and these are the two selects if you want to run it at the lower level: select bottomless_pit.speedwell_mine select oakden_level.speedwell_mine This is what I want: <image.png> If I add in a survey point to hook it to, then I get this: <image.png> Rather than this: <image.png> Adding in more survey points further down the passage to the south only increases the amount of distortion in a small space of passage. as there are three loop closures at the bottom of the picture [just below the red circle) which the model is running (i've just not included the maps on the drawing for clarity). Regards, Alastair Gott. AlastairGott@hotmail.com, M: 07931779380. _______________________________________________ Therion mailing list Therion@speleo.sk https://mailman.speleo.sk/listinfo/therion _______________________________________________ Therion mailing list Therion@speleo.sk https://mailman.speleo.sk/listinfo/therion
participants (3)
-
alastair gott -
Ben Cooper -
Benedikt Hallinger